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[Dino 1]

Hi, 

 

a quick introduction to myself: 

 

I have been an Alfa-Nuthead for a long time - started with two 33s, a 146 and ended up with a Spider v6 and a GTV TB some twelve years ago. Then I decided to move upmarket and traded in the Spider for a Maserati 4200 Spyder which I owned since last month. The reason why I sold the Spyder however is a funny thing: I found my original Alfa Spider by sheer luck at an internet marketplace. I immediately recognized the car as mine and decided I wanted it back for good. The Maserati Spyder was a great car, but the Alfa simply was more fun and more "mine" from the beginning. Hence - after 12 years, I got the car back with a new engine and some mayor restoration potential that I will start now during winter (as the previous owner did actually nothing to the car apart from low-cost repairs). Looking forward to discuss with you guys and maybe find some useful tips once I am out of luck... 

[Luigired 0]

Hi Dino, congratulations for the spider it seems in excellent condition. Have you started doing the jobs you were talking about?

[Dino 1]

Thanks Luigi! Yes - started with all major suspension areas - new dampers, wishbones etc. Runs very good again. Next update are the breaks. During next winter, I hopefully can commission a respray and some leather recoloring. 

 

 

[Baron von Headloq 2]

On 9/20/2019 at 19:30, Dino said:

Hi, 

 

a quick introduction to myself: 

 

I have been an Alfa-Nuthead for a long time - started with two 33s, a 146 and ended up with a Spider v6 and a GTV TB some twelve years ago. Then I decided to move upmarket and traded in the Spider for a Maserati 4200 Spyder which I owned since last month. The reason why I sold the Spyder however is a funny thing: I found my original Alfa Spider by sheer luck at an internet marketplace. I immediately recognized the car as mine and decided I wanted it back for good. The Maserati Spyder was a great car, but the Alfa simply was more fun and more "mine" from the beginning. Hence - after 12 years, I got the car back with a new engine and some mayor restoration potential that I will start now during winter (as the previous owner did actually nothing to the car apart from low-cost repairs). Looking forward to discuss with you guys and maybe find some useful tips once I am out of luck... 

 

 

Now that is a fabulous colour combination. The whole look is just right :-)

Edited July 6, 2020 by Baron von Headloq

[Dino 1]

NOS testing... :-)

[Dino 1]

Besides, I decided to also get a GTV TB back into my possession.... so here it is... It’s a 1999 GTV TB imported from the Netherlands. Runs very good and is practically immaculate. Have given it an inspection and the usual maintenance... 🥰

[Baron von Headloq 2]

23 minutes ago, Dino said:

Besides, I decided to also get a GTV TB back into my possession.... so here it is... It’s a 1999 GTV TB imported from the Netherlands. Runs very good and is practically immaculate. Have given it an inspection and the usual maintenance... 🥰

I like your choice  ... here's my TB (also ex Netherlands - it was in the 99-01/02 Dutch television series Westenwind, so a little interesting provenance). Not the best photograph, but taken on a testdrive after fitting a replacement catalyst recently. Next, new lower control arms and bushes ("querlenker") to sharpen up the front end a little.

 

It has a Remus centre silencer and a Zender quad-exit section after that. Just a bit too "loud" for my liking. Inside, noise levels are just fine. But it is too loud on the outside for my tastes. So I am pondering what to do with the Zender section. I need a rear silencer just to remove the "booming". But not to kill the Busso music

Edited July 5, 2020 by Baron von Headloq

[Dino 1]

Nice! Mine came without a MSD... so also quite noisy. Thinking of putting a smaller MSD back in... Do you have the Squadra Chip? 

[Baron von Headloq 2]

3 hours ago, Dino said:

Nice! Mine came without a MSD... so also quite noisy. Thinking of putting a smaller MSD back in... Do you have the Squadra Chip? 

Thanks - I enjoy the Vela Blu and tan leather combination. Your cream leather looks amazing though! One of the more striking Spiders I have seen

 

No, I don't have the Squadra chip - but it's on my "to buy" list! That, and a swap to the Mitsubishi turbo from the 164.

 

I'd put an MSD back in - the Busso will make itself heard even with one !  If I can find an ASSO ESD or MSD+ESD that is available before early August, I'll perhaps fit that. Then of course the Remus MSD will be sold, along with the Zender quad-outlet section.

 

Noise was fine on my hillclimb cars, but all of my roadcars elsewhere and now in Germany, have been not too noisy. I don't need every Streifenwagen stopping me to inspect my car!

[Baron von Headloq 2]

Dino, a quick question about your TB. Is yours on 16" or 17" wheels, and if on 17", then was this reflected on registration, or only as an update with TüV etc?

 

Registration of my TB in Germany was straightforward except for the 17" Teledials that are on my car. The TüV Rheinland technical data sheets reflect only the 205/50R16 tyre and obviously also the 16" rim size (so of course the local Zulassungsstelle would only enter the 205/50R16 size in the vehicle data). 

 

However, my TB was supplied new in the Netherlands with the optional 17" Teledials ... of course these are not reflected in the Fahrzeugbrief as they were not listed in the technical data sheet I received. Being pre-2004, there is no handy CoC document to refer to for the registration. All national homologation.

 

I will see what the TüV Süd gentleman says when I take it for TüV in the next weeks. 

Edited July 6, 2020 by Baron von Headloq

[Dino 1]

I had to do a "Vollabnahme" when I registered the Car in Cologne. It has the 17 inch Teledials on as well. I don't know if this is reflected in the papers, though. 

Edited July 6, 2020 by Dino

[Baron von Headloq 2]

 

5 hours ago, Dino said:

I had to do a "Vollabnahme" when I registered the Car in Cologne. It has the 17 inch Teledials on as well. I don't know if this is reflected in the papers, though. 

If you've got a TüV certificate now, then I think the Teledials and the 225/45R17s are probably reflected in your papers.

 

I think mine was also a Vollabnahme - the data showing in my German papers is as per the technical data sheet supplied to me by TüV Rheinland. I think the Teledials and the 225/45R17 tyres will be added at the TüV as both TüV Süd and DEKRA can check the validity of the Teledials and the tyre sizes (they have access to the data). I was just curious about yours!  Thanks for the answer.

Edited July 6, 2020 by Baron von Headloq

[Luigired 0]

On 5/7/2020 at 22:14, Dino said:

Test NOS ... :-)

Foto very beautiful! 

[Baron von Headloq 2]

13 minutes ago, Luigired said:

Foto very beautiful! 

It is a beautiful photo

[Dino 1]

Thanks guys! Felt even better to be on that track again after 7 or 8 years... But I was the only Alfa driver around... sad to see that there are less and less Alfisti driving their cars for what they were build for... 

[Luigired 0]

You are right. But we must resist, continuing to turn on the roads of the world with our Alfa cars.

[Dino 1]

🖖 I do my very best now... 😁

[Luigired 0]

Great! 👍

Dino, you who have both cars, can you tell us about the performance differences of the 3.0 V6 and 2.0 V6 TB?

[Dino 1]

The 3.0 24V is the easier car to drive - hands down. The TB however has a massive punch from 2.5K revs/min which is also a great experience. Given that one is an open top and the other one a coupe makes also a difference... As I know the Spider now for nearly 15 years, I guess he is my favorite still... but the GTV TB is faster and probably more nimble on the racetrack once I replaced his old tyres. You don’t expect me to tell you what’s my favorite child, do you?! 😆

[Luigired 0]

I am about to buy a Spider 3.0 V6 12v and I would like to know the driving impressions of those who have driven it. Do you have 3.0 24v? Does it give a strong acceleration boost?

[Dino 1]

Yes. Would suggest strongly to go for a 24V version (or TB in Italy). Never driven the 12v version but imho the 24v is probably the best and easy to live with. The TB can be tweaked (I have some kind of mod in there, I suspect) and hence run faster - but the 24V still is probably the one you should opt for

[Baron von Headloq 2]

11 hours ago, Dino said:

Yes. Would suggest strongly to go for a 24V version (or TB in Italy). Never driven the 12v version but imho the 24v is probably the best and easy to live with. The TB can be tweaked (I have some kind of mod in there, I suspect) and hence run faster - but the 24V still is probably the one you should opt for

The 3.0 24V is a lovely engine - no doubt about it. I've run older iterations of the Busso in the form of a 1982 GTV V6 2.5, and then also my South African homologation special, a 1985 GTV V6 3 litre (Autodelta-derived, first production 3 litre variant of the Busso).  I've had the chance to drive several 3.2 GTs, and a few 3.0 24V Spiders and GTVs. 

 

My comment on the 24V variants (3.0, 3.2) is that they just pull and pull all the way up the rev range (which is great!), and that the 12V variants do feel (subjectively) a little punchier lower down, and that there is seldom much point to revving them to near the rev limit.

 

I guess my comment boils down to the feeling that the 3.0 12V in a Spider is a good match - the Spider is arguably better driven in a slightly lazy way. It just feels like that kind of car to me. The GTV on the other hand feels more like a drive harder car. This is *ALL* very subjective!

 

OK, my 1985 116 series homologation car had short gearing and Dellortos (x6) ... that was very much a "drive hard and drive to win" car.

 

I am definitely enjoying the TB ... and most surprised at how tractable and pleasant it is off-boost as well. Does not feel underpowered when off-boost and driving with the rest of the road traffic ... not yet

 

Thoughts?

Edited July 8, 2020 by Baron von Headloq

[Dino 1]

Agree fully with your comments on the 24v and the TB versions. I have never driven a NA 12v version, hence I cannot comment on that characteristics. I used to know someone who had a 12V Spider and he was pretty happy with the car, though. I guess however that the spacepart situation for the 12v NA engines is even more dire than for the 24v versions... 

[Luigired 0]

Thank you Paolo (Baron Von ...) for your comment. I have never tried the 3.0 Busso in its variants, but I have heard several times that the 12 valve has a huge torque at the bottom while the 24 valve pushes a lot up and has better acceleration performance. As for the 2.0 V6 TB I felt that it has an angry push!
I agree with your ratings.
The only Busso engine that I tested was my grandfather's Alfa 90 2.0 V6 naturally aspirated injection. It was fantastic: it had a great pair, a wonderful progressivity in the delivery of power, and at that time it was the most powerful aspirated 2.0 on the market among sedans (as it had happened with the Alfetta years ago)

[Baron von Headloq 2]

1 hour ago, Luigired said:

Thank you Paolo (Baron Von ...) for your comment. I have never tried the 3.0 Busso in its variants, but I have heard several times that the 12 valve has a huge torque at the bottom while the 24 valve pushes a lot up and has better acceleration performance. As for the 2.0 V6 TB I felt that it has an angry push!
I agree with your ratings.
The only Busso engine that I tested was my grandfather's Alfa 90 2.0 V6 naturally aspirated injection. It was fantastic: it had a great pair, a wonderful progressivity in the delivery of power, and at that time it was the most powerful aspirated 2.0 on the market among sedans (as it had happened with the Alfetta years ago)

The 'Bialbero' / Nord twincam engine is a favourite of mine, the first Twinspark 2 litres, and of course every single Busso variant! I have a fondness for the 12V Bussos mainly because of the exhaust note (very objective !), and the 24V variants for the seemingly endless torque delivery. My friend's 3.2 GT will trickle away from just above idle in 6th gear - and that is at 1650m above sea level. And then pull through to almost the redline. That is impressive flexibility. We used to compare the music when we both had 2.5 116 V6s (mine white, his pale metallic green). I would love to try the naturally-aspirated Busso 2 litre ... I am guessing that it was very smooth, and possibly more rev-happy than the 3 litre. No surprise really, if there is less reciprocating and rotating mass to accelerate ... 

 

The "Baron von Headloq" handle/name has origins from around 2001, me being labeled as such by some colleagues at the University where I was at the time, and an incident at a Waldorf school nearby, in South Africa. But best told over some beer ... or wine!

 

It has just occurred to me - the bialbero is also by Guiseppe Busso ...

 

It ALSO occurs to me that I am busy hijacking Dino's thread! Mi scuso, Dino!

Edited July 8, 2020 by Baron von Headloq