Old is cool..V6 TB in Turkey.

[Anil 2]

Hi guys...My name is Anil,34 years old and I live in Turkey. I have a 1998 GTV V6 TB. I bought my GTV four years ago and I changed all of sensors and electronics parts because of age. I modified some parts. My GTV condition was good end of the four years.

 

Engine;

-All car racing(Italy) chip tuning

-Pipercross sponge filter

- Exhaust tuning(removed cat., end of muffler and mounted sports middle muffler) 

- Mitsubishi TD05 12B turbo

-Walbro GSS 342 high pressure fuel pump

 

 Shock Absorbers;

-Front Koni Sport Adjustable

-Rear Monreo Reflex

-Rear 20mm spacers

Brakes;

-Brembo Max pads and discs

 

17" Toora Alfa Romeo Alloy Wheels and 215/45 R17 tyres

 

İnterior;

-Individual red leather seats

- Black leather-red stitch steering wheel and gear knob

- Mat chrome effect gauge rings

-156 air vents

 

etc......

 

Edited December 19, 2013 by Anil

[Anil 2]

I have a two Italian in my garage:) It's my two wheels Italian! GTV's little brother;Ducati Monster 696+...Generally, I ride a motocycle in a day. At the weekend, I drive short tour my GTV... GTV isn't suitable for daily life because of traffic and engine warm!

Edited December 11, 2013 by Anil

[Thanos 193]

Welcome!

I am a huge fun of Monster..  I used to have one many years ago..

My brother owns a speed triple so I have the opportunity to ride a bike every summer.

Sad story that Ducati is on Audi hands at the moment.

[Anil 2]

   I love Italian bikes and owned Gilera,Aprilia,Piaggio and Derbi(half Italian) many years ago. I used to have two yamaha last 4 years and turned back Italian bike! Ducati was my dream since childhood.

I like old monster(S4R,695 etc.) The new monster looks basic; a lot of parts are plastic, hasn't dry clutch,has full digital gauges etc.

  In my opinion, may be the story is sad or may be good. We will look to the future! 

[kunev 131]

And another TB from Turkey  .

Why you have choose Monroe Reflex for the back and how they feel? Koni Sport at front and Monroe Reflex at the back ... very strange combination in my opinion.

I think that this is a second TB from Turkey with "All car racing" chip on here, probably that company is very popular there. How is the car after installing of the chips?

[Paso 239]

Very nice and tidy! Welcome Anil!

[Anil 2]

   Thanks for posting. Yes, shock absorber system is strange. First, I want to buy full koni system but I didn't find in Turkey, Alfistinet and another parts site in internet. I bought monroe reflex set in Turkey but this set was wrong (2.0 TS). I called the dealer and I bought only rear shock absorber! One day, I visited my friend shop and I saw Koni Sport Adjustable Tubes and I mounted in my original front shock absorber construction. May be, I will buy Koni STR-T or sport in future but now,this combination is good for me.(I am using konis the middle position) 

  All Car Racing is not populer but my friend is dealer

  Alfa Romeo GTV 2.0 TS is rare. Generally, you can see 2.0 V6 TB in Turkey.

[kunev 131]

There are options for rear dampers for now. You have done the difficult part - front dampers. And I see that you have do it with custom fabrication. Do you still use original springs?

 

  Alfa Romeo GTV 2.0 TS is rare. Generally, you can see 2.0 V6 TB in Turkey.

  Very interesting and strange to me!

[Filip 124]

  All Car Racing is not populer but my friend is dealer

 

Give us more information, please 

[Anil 2]

There are options for rear dampers for now. You have done the difficult part - front dampers. And I see that you have do it with custom fabrication. Do you still use original springs?

 

  Very interesting and strange to me!

You know, all of the gtv rear dampers are same but 2.0-3.0-2.0 V6 TB use different front dampers.Especially, V6 TB dampers are rare in internet or dealer. For example, v6 tb fornt dampers production is stopped by Koni and Bilstein.

Yes, we use custom front dampers. You know, Koni's tubes are changed if they have damage. you can buy only tubes and put in damper construction. We used this method, I bought 2 Koni Sport tubes (they are suitable original dimensions) and cut top of the original dampers,removed original tubes and we put koni tubes in fabrication dampers construction. This process is cheaper than new konis but have workmanship

I still use original springs. If I use lower springs, my gtv will not enter the garage because of lowering.

In Turkey, all of spiders are 2.0 TS (one of them 3.0 12v), huge percent of Gtv's is V6 TB maybe 3-4 Gtv have a 2.0 TS engine. GTV/Spider 3.0 TS engines have never sold in Turkey from 1995 to 2002. GTV and spider are totally 40-50.

[Anil 2]

Give us more information, please 

My friend is All Car Racing/Superchips dealer and rally mechanicer in Turkey. He recommended this chip and I have used it about 3 years.

Link for your engine;

http://www.allcarracing.com/en/Prodotti/chiptuning-select.asp?id=ALFA%20ROMEO

This link is main menu;

http://www.allcarracing.com/

[charlee 314]

Koni's tubes are changed if they have damage. you can buy only tubes and put in damper construction. We used this method, I bought 2 Koni Sport tubes (they are suitable original dimensions) and cut top of the original dampers,removed original tubes and we put koni tubes in fabrication dampers construction. This process is cheaper than new konis but have workmanship

 

My front right Koni has leaked and this sounds really promising to me. How much does the tube cost and where can I get it? What exactly need to be done to fit it?

[Damgreg 94]

Increase of HP up to 40 hp is IMPOSSIBLE running stock setup (for your engine/turbo durability).

With oem gesture you can't raise more than 1.3b for more than 5sec (or smtg like that).

 

With Squadra Tuning chips, T25 and oem fuel pressure /injectors 1.3b we can reach a max of 235hp (in theory.. Squadra Tuning in NL told me that it depends on the age, mileage, air leaks, candle wires, etc). There we reach the max limit of the fuel cut off.

With a bigger turbo (like a mitsu td05, gt28) your can reach 270hp by increasing fuel pressure and/or fuel flow. 

[Anil 2]

 

My GTV has a Mitsubishi TD 05 12B turbo and I changed my fuel pump with walbro GSS 342 high pressure pump. I have not a problem about my car when it was tuned with chip. It has never cut off the rpm or fuel.

 

Edited December 19, 2013 by Anil

[Damgreg 94]

You are running chips adapted for your TD05 or adapted for the T25?

Injection maps are not the same for both.

 

A friend "amande.salee" was running Squadra Tuning (for T25) chips with a TD0512B. He tried my chips and still keep them in his Gtv.

Mine are made for a TD04HL but they are quite the same. Your inlet is a bit larger.

 

What he said after trying my chips:

Here I think its coming

compared to the first day , it torque much better, gesture is adapting the map 

 

I remain at all speeds on all report a few seconds , to adapt the AFR

 

I took the highway just to make 5th gear

 

I also try to do pulls at different rpm

 

 

and she runs better, may be even better than before

 

this morning I smell the gasoline, I must still be a bit too rich (He is running Golf G60 260cc injectors)

 

 

in the other side I think it works much better in the high rpm

 

before with the ST chips, past 6000 I did not have too much turbo leaks, but I felt a loss of power

 

 

with Zamuner chips it works much stronger in the high rpm , and it rupte further (7300 rpm)

 

it always loads to 3500tours but I find that it lasts much longer and better in high rpm

2 weeks after ...

there we are, it works hard : twisted:

clear difference especially in high rpm.....

 

when the turbo charging : GET OARS

 

it must still remain a small adjustment period , the cold start is still around 1300/1400 , it is still a little high , and they drink a lot of benzene with 4 daily start under 0 degrees Celsius

 

the idle speed is perfect slows to 700/800 rpm

 

but it is certain that they are suitable for a large turbo instead of ST chips

 

 

[Damgreg 94]

By relying on the words of amande.salee who's a bible about turbos he said that T25 can't support more than 1.3b because of its 270° bearing. Squadra Tuning used to reach those 1.3b on overboost but immediately down to 1.1b on constant pressure. 

 

Chips randomly designed will just add turbo pressure, maybe adjusting injection maps but you have to be careful with this T25. The bearing will break if you reach this limit often. This is why you have fuel cut off on over pressure detection.

 

With bigger turbo with a 360° bearing you can reach 1.5b on OB (1.6b seems to be the limit of the head gasket)

for a couple of second and then, limit the boost at 1.2/1.3b just under the cut off limit.

 

And now you can get more power with greater safety for your turbo 

 

Hard to explain things in a clear english when you don't use to...   

[kunev 131]

My GTV has a Mitsubishi TD 05 12B turbo and I changed my fuel pump with walbro GSS 342 high pressure pump. I have not a problem about my car when it was tuned with chip. It has never cut off the rpm or fuel.

I think you have to mention these upgrades in the first post in the list of changes  .  Bigger turbo is significant upgrade in my opinion!

So you still use stock injectors and fuel pressure regulator? If answer is yes, the max flow that can be injected in the engine is the same as stock. Is the chips specially made for your setup or they are common chips for stock TB? What boost pressure you are running?

About mentioned figure on the site. First times I saw that increased HP is from 30 hp, so I though this is normal for chip tuning of TB. But today I look again and see that mentioned increase is from 30 to 70 hp! And there isn't mentioned that hardware changes are needed for that. I will start one topic about chip tuning adverts  .

[Anil 2]

Damgred and Kunev, thank you for your interest. I will answered totally.

- I don't know that td05 12b and T25 haven't similar injection map. I know only;TD 05 is bigger and have a more power. Maps title is interesting for me, I will talk my friend about this title,maybe I will change my program! 

-Mits. TD05 12B is used in 164 V6 TB engine and I know; some old gtv have a same turbo(model 96-97) but my gtv is 1998! I saw my turbo when I bought my gtv 4 years ago. I didn't change it. My turbo is changed by old owner.

- My friend called All Car Racing staff that his name is "Enriko" and we wanted him hard program, maybe he sent us 2. option(70HP)

- Old fuel pump made a sound and I changed it with walbro gss342. Walbro is cheaper than original pump and common fuel pump in Turkey but I still use stock injector and fuel regulator.Yes, fuel flow is same as stock now.

- After the chip, turbo whistle is very noise,especially +4000rpm!

- I haven't problem about engine(cut off, handling etc.) but it's smoother than original.

- "And now you can get more power with greater safety for your turbo" I liked this proposition

- Can we use 164 V6 TB tuning program on my GTV?

(Sorry, my English is not good)

Edited December 19, 2013 by Anil

[Anil 2]

My front right Koni has leaked and this sounds really promising to me. How much does the tube cost and where can I get it? What exactly need to be done to fit it?

Charlee, Koni use 2 or three different size tubes in sport shock absorbers. These tubes are changed new one but you have to know tube size. Important sizes are tube lenght and diameter,centre shaft diameter and lenght! I bought pair of tubes,these price is 150 Euro.

We used same process;

 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1219607

 

 

http://www.planet-9.com/987-cayman-boxster-modifications/64629-koni-shock-insert-project-2.html

You can see Koni Sport Tubes;

http://www.ebay.com/bhp/koni-inserts

Edited December 19, 2013 by Anil

[kunev 131]

Software fuel cut off is based on air flow going into the engine. But this can be changed with reprogramming. But the injectors will reach its max flow (100% duty cycle=constantly opened) at some airflow which is programmed in the chip. And when the airflow continue to increase, the fuel flow can't follow it and the AFR will become leaner than it should be and this can be dangerous. Stock injectors are really small for turbo upgrade (which is not driven on low boost).

So you don't know what is your max boost pressure now. When performance upgrades are made it is advisable to be installed boost gauge.

There isn't GTV with Mitsubishi turbo from factory. Only older 164 TB have used such.

Do you know if the chips, which was on the car before you change them, are original one?

[Damgreg 94]

What Kunev says about fuel flow is totaly true. You will run lean if you do not managed to incerase your fuel pressure. A friend is running TD05 and oem injectors and oem fuel pressure gauge and monitor its AFR with an AEM manometer and it's just a bit lean but it's ok. What about duty cycles of the injectors... Don't know...

My fuel regulator have been manually recalibrated. You can easily but perilously do it by yourself!

[Anil 2]

First of all, I will buy maxigauges (inc.AFR,boost,EGT...)

[kunev 131]

... A friend is running TD05 and oem injectors and oem fuel pressure gauge and monitor its AFR with an AEM manometer and it's just a bit lean but it's ok. 

TD05 from 164 V6 TB? At what pressure the turbo is running, especially at the high rpm?

Anil, wait for answer to bellow question  .

Do you know if the chips, which was on the car before you change them, are original one?

My opinion about gauges is - boost, oil pressure, AFR. The more is better, but where to put them will be a problem and too much additional gauges is not cool on street car in my opinion.

[Damgreg 94]

Td05 from a 164, right!

In 5th gear turbo pressure reach 1.5b on overboost and stay at 1.3 on continuous boost. My rpm limiter is set to 7200. It goes at 1.1b near to the limiter.

For the gauges I have a custom made support with oil pressure, oil temp and turbo pressure.

Edited January 12, 2014 by Damgreg

[Anil 2]

Update with 18" rims, custom exhaust(inc. downpipe) and Ph2 interior...

 

 

Edited December 18, 2018 by Anil